Duelyst Forums

Newb Questions (Gold and Spirit)

#1

Okay, so I just started playing Duelyst a few days ago. I have been enjoying myself and the gameplay seems quite solid, but I have run into a few problems that I could use some answers for if anyone has the time to help a newb out.

To clarify exactly how newbish I am, here is what I have done so far in-game:

  1. Leveled all factions to 10+ (highest being lvl 16)
  2. Completed all solo challenges
  3. Reached rank ~18 (35 wins)
  4. Have opened ~20 spirit orbs
  5. I killed Orias the Heretic (boss)
  6. I have not spent real moneys on the game as of this moment

So what am I actually asking? …

a) Well gold seems very slow to gain. It feels odd to keep playing when I cannot gain any more gold for the day. Am I missing some way to gain gold that would fix my inability to progress without just shutting the game off and waiting till tomorrow? I noticed the 3 game win bonus of 15 gold, but I think it takes aprox ~2 hours for me to get 3 wins, which seems hardly worth farming

b) Now Because of of the first question, I am unable to get any interesting cards, since my resources are rather limited as a new player, but it seems that almost everyone I play against has a deck full of synergizing cards with seemingly no limits, but when I look up these cards in crafting, I would need to disenchant my entire “collection” to get 1 of them (if that).

I wouldn’t mind it too much if I ran into them every few games, but these decks show up like every other game now. I am not exactly sure how the rankings work, but it seems like I lose 3 games in a row (two of which are legendary decks), losing 3 points and dropping down a rank. Then I win a game or two to end up back where I started. Is this normal? Does everyone at rank 20+ have these decks and I am the odd one out?

Here are some replays of the decks I keep running into.

Abyssian Teleportation (Aggro?)
https://play.duelyst.com/replay?replayId=-LDelw_XEwq76XEqJoDq

Magmar Illusions (Growth?)
https://play.duelyst.com/replay?replayId=-LDeqiq-tonA4ExLP1p4

Abyssian Shadow Creep (Build up -> KO?)
https://play.duelyst.com/replay?replayId=-LDefHGTV3QgVKWgMnCN

ᴄ) Okay so more importantly though, is there any way I can compete with these cards/decks that doesn’t involve owning these cards/decks? Do I just need to grind out the month or 20 of doing quests to get enough gold to purchase the cards everyone is using, or can I make a competent deck out of the starter cards?

I have seen several “budget” decklists, but I don’t own most of the cards in them. And looking at the spirit costs makes me kinda laugh… when “budget” decks cost more than 10x the spirit I could get from disenchanting almost every card I have gained from the spirit orbs I opened so far.

d) As a beginner, what should I actually be spending my gold on anyways? I have just been opening spirit orbs, since that seemed obvious, but the exact orb I have been mostly just picking at random. In hindsight, that might actually be why none of my cards seem to synergize very well.

e) What about gauntlet? Is it worth saving and using gold on? I failed the free try super hard (I tried to make deck I saw someone else use in ranked, but ended up making a useless deck with the limited options) and got 0 wins. I got something like 20 spirit and a core spirit orb, which seems less than the value of 150 gold, but… that’s with 0 wins. How many wins are required to make it worth more than 1.5 spirit orbs?

f) The rainbow cards are just visuals right? Just a “haha I’m cooler than you” effect… nothing actually game changing in any way… right?

g) If I get a few legendary/rare cards for a faction I haven’t been playing, does that mean I should scrap my current faction and build a deck around the new cards? From what I have seen, most legendary cards can just instantly win the game from nowhere, but the people using them also seem to have x3 of multiple legendaries creating the game-winning effects, so I am not sure 1-2 would create the same effect.

h) Okay, so how about disenchanting the legendary cards to create a budget deck for the factions I use? Is that a waste of a legendary, or are the disenchant rates pretty fair? They don’t seem to be.

F.A.Q. Construction Thread
#2

Don’t have much time to reply all (maybe I’ll edit later) but fyi, as a casual average player, by just doing my daily quests everyday (10ish matches), boss fight on Thursday and benefit from Twitch drops, I make a dozen orb/week.

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#3

Twitch drops… I will have to check that out. I will repeat the fact that I have opened ~20 spirit orbs, and have only been playing for 2-3 days so… I guess my idea of slow might be a bit different than others.

The main point is that I am mostly playing against people with impressive “expensive” decks, which doesn’t seem… “fair” since I would think they should be a much higher rank than I am with decks like that, and if I am supposed to have a deck like that already, I must have missed something related to gaining currency or drops.

#4

The common answer would be : if you’re skilled enough, you can beat even an expensive deck with core cards, some guys are bringing a fresh account to S every season starting from zero (@hsuku FZTH, but honestly, he’s talented).

It’s gonna be a little painful and you may struggle … too bad you started after Unranked was removed. It’s was a Mode where you could have won versus “expensive” decks more often, learn the cards, make a few more gold, with no Ladder pressure.

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#5

a) On the ladder you will generally get at least enough gold for 1 orb a day by completing daily quests and simply playing.

b) As you already noticed, there are many players in Silver who play seemingly overpowered wallet decks but still can’t make it even to gold. There are multiple reasons behind this but the most important are 1) they generally make lots of misplays every game 2) most of the decks they play are actually pretty bad.

c) The first thing to do is start improving your positioning, if you position poorly even with the best deck in the game you won’t be able to win. Whereas if you position properly even dirt cheap decks can take you very high. @boronian is usually willing to review matches for new players and give them advice on how to position better. You can also watch streamers and other good players and note what they play around and how they play in general.

The second thing to do is get a proper budget deck, I don’t know where you have been seeing 10k spirit “budget” decks are but 10k certainly isn’t budget. Budget decks are 2k spirit maximum and can cost much less. If you want help making a budget deck you can post which faction you plan to main, how much spirit you have to spare and what notable cards you already have. The forumgoers will gladly try to help you make a budget deck from what you have at your disposal.

d) The best Spirit orbs to buy are core Orbs, they have the best drop rate and many of the best cards in the game are from the core set (a notable example is Magmar’s Makantor Warbeast).

e) Gauntlet is a place where if you are good you will get really rich, and if you are bad you will get broke. IIRC, getting at least 3 wins is a good goal for new players where your reward is roughly worth the gold spent. Getting at least 7 wins is the next important goal because that is where you get a free gauntlet ticket which essentially pays the entry fee for you. Another important thing to know is that the gauntlet plays very differently from the ladder, what is good on the ladder might be bad in the gauntlet and visa-verse (a good example is ranged minions, on the ladder they see almost no play but in the gauntlet they can win games by themself).

f) Prismatics are purely cosmetic and have no effect on the gameplay. Some people just like shiny things.

g) I would advise against swapping factions altogether just because of one legendary but you can certainly use it as a reason to give other factions a try. In Duelyst at the moment there aren’t any Legendary cards that win games by themself, in fact, a good portion of Legendary cards are just flashy cards with cool but often impractical effects. That does not mean you don’t need legendary cards at all since some of them are actually good, but simply that with enough skill you do not need Legendaries to climb the ladder.

h) It is fine as a new player to disenchant Legendary cards to make budget decks (although you might want to tell us which legendaries you have so we can give you advice which legendaries are better to keep and which ones are better to disenchant). The disenchant rates are pretty fair (as long as you don’t overdo it and disenchant too much) and Prismatic cards disenchant for full value so feel free to disenchant them first if you are in need of spirit.

#6

Other guys have given you EXCELLENT answers. I’m just going to add a tidbit:

Synergy in opponent decks looks overwhelming for a beginner, but listen to me as it’s very counter intuitive: Good cards with no synergy win just as well as snowballing synergy monster decks.

I didn’t believe it, and I watched @hsuku’s stream, and it’s true. He wins a fair amount of games against high level players, facing synergy unlimited-budget decks and himself using only commons.

Skill and positioning is more important than deck type. The ability of understanding what the opponent’s deck is about is also very important.

And playing after the Gold rewards are gone for the day helps building that experience, along with the monthly rewards you get from being higher up on the ladder.

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#7

From my experience, I recommend you not to disenchant everything from your less played factions deliberately. You are just starting, and it’s hard to understand what faction fits you best. There are several disenchant guides floating around that may help you decide which cards are absolutely safe to DE, and which are useful.

Btw, every 3 wins are worth 15 gold, so quests are not the only way.

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#8

@invinciblewall
I just watched your first replays and i gotta say:

You have a really good grasp at the game. Holding the Tiger while the Phantasm was on the board was a really smart move. The way you protected it with positioning and blocking minions also was good.
There were some minor misplays, but the biggest problems I saw were:

  • You had no removal in hand. Try to put more removal into your deck . Removal is very important in card based games. A simple basic card like a Demonic Lure (which you had) or Dark Transformation would have killed the Sworn Sister that gave life to the opponent. Would you have killed her 1-2 Turns after she was deployed, your Saberspine should have been guaranteed lethal. (for those who didn’t watch- it was a 16/2). Think carefully about which minion you absolutely have to use the removal on or not. Disrupting the opponent to deny the early game tile with a Lure on a 1/3? Is one mana denied really worth the card or might it be more useful later ( as you were able to see in the illusionist game)
  • You have to switch to cards that better suit your deck theme. This doesn’t mean that you need those legendaries people are using, but it would help a lot to replace: Abyssal Crawler, Drybone Golem, Horn of the Forsaken, Rogue Warden, Fire Spitter and if you don’t stumble upon Provoke minions each game, even Hollow Grovekeeper. These cards don’t really use the Potential Lilithe has.

For the first steps of a Lilith deck I usually think in packages, not in whole budget decks.

  1. Craft a playset Furiosa This is the core of an engine to buff your Wraithlings to make them more threatening (120 Spirit)
  2. Craft a playset Cryptographer. He is additional Fuel for the engine (120 Spirit)
  3. Craft 2-3 Furor Chakrams. The sole reason to play this is because it gives you a gigantic boost when your minion producing engine is running. (200-300 spirit)
  4. This is the step when any other cards that like Swarm or chakram come into play.
  • Bloodtide priestress is synergystic with the engine and the Chakram
  • Saberspine Tiger ( especially when buffed with Phantasm) profits very much from the Furor Chakram buff.
  • Young Flamewing, a core card profits also very much from the Furor Chakram buff.
  1. Dont forget to run enough removal. I recommend 3 Lures and 2-3 Dark Transformations.

Please look at your deck and try to apply those steps. I hope you can adapt the engine without losing too much of your own ideas.
Good luck and have fun!

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#9

Hey hey, welcome to the game, you’ve already gotten some good answers, but I wanted to chime in my own perspective too, since last March I played new Free to Play account to S rank in under 100 games in less than a week, the article for which I put up here

The game is pretty free-to-play friendly, but it helps to know what you’re doing, the community is by and large pretty happy and helpful to answering questions and giving tips and so on.

Any player can benefit from the wiki, but a new player especially might benefit from reading this section: https://duelyst.gamepedia.com/New_Player_Guides

There’s a number of budget decks there as well a bit at the bottom there with a disenchanting guide which you may find useful.

As for gauntlet it’s okay value if you can get around 50% win rate, but the rewards get real enticing once you can get 7 wins, so maybe hold off unless you enjoy the mode (it is good fun).

Best of luck mate!

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#10

Thank you so much for all the responses! Kinda surprised how quickly everyone responded actually.

@nwardezir
I am not sure an unranked mode would have changed too much for me. I probably would have played only unranked, but unless the matches were (on average) easier, it wouldn’t have changed anything… I just wouldn’t have had a rank.

I will definitely have to watch some streamers though. I haven’t really done that for any games before, so it should be quite interesting.

Haha, that would be even more ridiculous @phoinexflame. I actually said

so… 2,000 was about what they were, and 200 is about how much I could have… I think… maybe I have more, but I didn’t want to disenchant anything that could potentially have value without knowing whether it was actually valuable or not. I have disenchanted some very powerful cards in previous CCGs that I regretted later, so I am waiting till I have a bit more knowledge on it (with a few exceptions).

Ouch… I don’t think I bought more than like 3 core orbs lol.

Lyonar:
[legend] Decimate x1
[legend] Indominus x1
[epic] Lionize x1
[epic] Windcliffe Protector x1

Songai:
[legend] Mask of Shadows x1
[epic] Horned Mask x1
[unique?] Hideatsu the Ebon Ox x1

Abyssian:
[unique?] Underlord Xor’Xuul x1

Vanar:
[epic] Permafrost x2

Neutral:
[legend] Hollow Grovekeeper x1
[epic] Araki Headhunter x1
[epic] Alcuin Loremaster x1
[epic] Hsuku x1 (disenchanted already… hopefully don’t regret that)

I have mainly been playing Magmar and Abyssian, and have a few cards that I believe are good (and probably aren’t).
[rare] Bloodtide Priestess x1
[rare] Tectonic Spikes x1
[rare] Omniseer x1
[common] Phantasm x3
[common] Amplification x1
[common] Angered Okkadok x3
[common] Bellow x3
[common] Krater x2
[common] Maw x1
[common] Rogue Warden x1
[common] Deathblighter x2
[common] Saberspine Alpha x2

These are not a deck or my full list of cards, they are just non-base cards that I have mainly been playing with and found useful. If I had to describe the way I have been playing and creating decks it would be something of a rush/aggro deck that just focuses on bursting down my opponent before they can respond. If they successfully defend, I basically just auto-lose. This might also be why legendary cards keep giving me such a hard time, since they do funky things like wipe the field, scramble the field, and otherwise can create a lot of chaos that I cannot overcome simply with the “my numbers are bigger than your numbers” strategy.

#11

If you want we can practice some matches and I can give you tips on positioning, give budget lists, card crafting priorities etc.

Also, a very good way to grind hold is gauntlet, once you learn how to run it successfully.

Usually my answers are much more in depth, but I just woke up and it looks like everyone else said what was needed to be said

#12

Woah! Thanks for the super detailed response. Sadly, I didn’t even see what the Sworn Sister was doing until it was way too late. I still don’t know most cards, and it’s very easy to miss cards being played when the board is as chaotic as that one was. I felt like I could have won that game when I watched the replay due to several mistakes I made, but looking back there were several situations where my opponent foolishly ignored the Phantasm, which seemed even more questionable than my plays, but maybe I just lost track of which of her minions were actually still active.

That being said, I know full well that my decks could use tuning. That’s part of why I jumped on here. They feel like they need tuning, but I feel like I am lacking all the tools to tune with (cards). I will be looking at the disenchant guide, which might fix the lack of spirit issue.

I actually had stopped playing Magmar because I couldn’t get enough removal to deal with Abyssian decks. The removal I had in my Mamgar decks flat out wouldn’t work against a 20/20 Shadow Watcher running at my face. I only recently discovered the Ephemeral Shroud that could counter the 20/20 Shadow Watcher and threw 3 copies in all of my decks. I have since then trimmed it out, since I don’t think it belongs in every deck, but I am still learning.

I was only trying Cassyva in that game because I had just unlocked her and got the weird unique Abyssian card and wanted to see if I could complete the destiny using her spell (yeah… uh… no). I mostly play Lilith and Vaath.

#13

These are my personal opinions on how good your cards are. They’ll be a subjective standard, of course, but perhaps it can help you plan on what cards to keep and what cards to disenchant.

Lyonar

Disenchant. It looks decent on paper, but it’s very inconsistent and niche. Many of the Lyonar decks in the meta right now does not have space for even Martyrdom, so you won’t be getting a chance to use this card any time soon.

Disenchant. Honestly, Indominus is a massive disappointment. It’s not in the meta at the moment, never has been, and probably never will be. The sole reason it exists is presumably to be in the card pool for random summons by a card called Grand Strategos. (It is nice if you get in on board for free with a card effect, but not if you summon it yourself.)

Disenchant. Very confusing card, but it’s very weak and nobody cares about it. Giving a minion Celerity is a decent buff, but only if it was on a 3 or 4 mana effect. The positioning restriction doesn’t really help either. I suppose it was supposed to combo with Gryphon Fledgling, a card that was printed in the same expansion, but it’s very niche and unrecommended.

Disenchant. Very underwhelming card, even if combined with Windcliffe Alarmist. I know I shouldn’t be telling you to disenchant everything, but somehow, you managed to pull some of the worst Lyonar cards in existence, instead of something like Holy Immolation or Trinity Oath. Sorry.

Songhai

Disenchant. Artifact Songhai is starting to emerge in the meta, but it doesn’t run this card. If you really want to delve into the archetype and test it throughly, try playing around with it, as it’s not a awful card. Otherwise, 350 spirit looks pretty nice.

Hold up, @loliconartist tells you to keep it. He’s a better player than me, and probably knows more about Songhai. The decision is up to you.

Disenchant. Again, not horrible, but underwhelming. If you want to play Backstab Songhai, you’re welcome to keep it and test it out, but keep in mind it’s not a very strong archetype and a normal Midrange build would usually be recommended.

This is a Mythron card! You can only own one of these, and you cannot disenchant them. As for Ebon Ox, it’s a trash card. You won’t use it, but you’re forced to keep it. :sweat_smile:

Abyssian

Also a Mythron card. Unlike Ebon Ox, Xor is actually a very powerful card and is a popular win-condition in many Dying Wish decks. Definitely recommended.

Vanar

Keep. It’s a very weak card that belongs in a very weak archetype, but at least it’s playable. You already have two copies too, which is always nice. (I suggest you further consult @wardl on this topic matter; l he’s the guy to go to when you want some advice on Stun.)

Neutral

Disenchant. This card apparently used to be really good, but that was probably before I started playing this game. Probably only belongs in the most niche deck in the world at the moment.

I don’t have a clear answer for this. It’s a weak card, but I heard some people trying to build a deck out of this one way or another. Keep it for now, but if you’re short on spirit, you’re always free to give it up.

Keep it. Very useful combo tool in various Mythron decks and Burn decks. It has synergy with Intensify spells as well.

You won’t. :joy:

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#14

Keep mask of shadows, they DO run that card, and is often an unexpected win con

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#15

@hsuku stream is as good as the card is bad :wink:

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#16

Watch scarzig for some lit memes

#17

Really? I stand corrected.

1 Like
#18

Yes, you run it with tracer and sometimes flicker, and because you are playing artihai with spells and artifacts people dont wall hug, leaving you to get free 7 damage face, then letting you clear minions behind them when they try to run away for another free 7 damage.

Pretty awesome.

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#19

Weird, both linked disenchant lists also state:

Mask of Shadows: 1/5, Disenchant

and

Mask of Shadows: Bad - With obscuring blow out from rise of the bloodborn, this nerfed and battered artifact is pretty much rendered obsolete. Too conditional, not enough damage, run obscuring blow instead.

Other than that, it looks like my lack of spirit problems are suddenly solved… lol. :sweat_smile:

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#20

It is indeed. Duelyst does have quite the collection of really bad epics and legendaries. On a side note, I’m not sure the disenchant guides you’re referencing are regularly updated or not. I personally think artifact Songhai is stronger than it used to be in the past, but again, the choice is up to you.