OK, OK, maybe I was in a bad mood, or met loads of EMP when I wrote this. I should probably reevalute it since you both are so fond of it.
Still, it doesn’t have any immediate value and costs 4…
Miguel's Abyss deck and discussion space
4 Likes
@zerounderscoreou
DFC is generally better than Grimwar in Xor because:
- Maehv’s bbs breaks artifacts
- You lose health punching stuff.
- Grimwar makes your general the target of all your opponent’s damage. DFC can be used to distract your opponent.
@alplod
As the others have mentioned, the deck has a great opening, but weak mid and late game.
I would recommend the alcuine brothers over shadow dancer though. Maehv’s swarms usually has a few minions dying per turn, not a ton at once that dancer prefers.
I.e. I’d replace bloodtear with lure, and herald with alcuines.
4 Likes
Okay this is actually interesting.
Most Q’orrhlma’A lists are a bit awkward because they are stuffed with 2-drops of doubtful quality. Q player will assume the defensive role in the early game, and try to survive until he can drop the late-game bombs.
But a double ramp Dying Wish could still enjoy a strong aggressive early and mid game… then drop Q’orrhlma’A and do the boogie-woogie with Spectral Revenants or whatever late game monstruosity. Its card draw engine should be reinforced to avoid an empty hand at 6 mana for Q drop.
3 Likes
First tests feel like the deck flow is fine and Q’orrhlma’A definitely fits. It makes the end game very reliable without sacrificing the mid game.
For this first attempt I went with Rush Chakram (with a chance of Mechaz0r! because I’m a funny guy).
@deathsadvocate will find a lot to optimize in this pot-pourri.
The concept is probably very flexible regarding General choice and end-game combo preference.
The recipe is:
- Double Dying Wish ramp and shell
- Q’orrhlma’A
- Your choice of end-game bombs or combos
- Playtest the deck to adjust the amount of draw depending on the above
5 Likes
Interesting, I could see this working! The big thing is the 7 mana turn: you’d probably either want to have no DW stuff over 4 mana (a more all-in Q version), or want to have at least 6+ DW minions with 5+ mana (so in your list maybe drop the Aethermasters and fill in the 2-offs). Otherwise you may end up playing a single Grimes the turn after Q.
3 Likes
it seems like q fits in any ramp deck that rely on massive ramp boosts
3 Likes
Interesting principal, but I feel it may be rather counter intuitive as the point of double ramp dying wish is so you can drop multiple cheap but strong units. We also run into the issue of the decks core card advantage engine will likely get deleted, and that when you do get double ramp early on you tend to be in really good shape already. I spent awhile trying to brew something but I just can not come up with anything.
But while we are on the topic let me drop my old Abyss Q list with a small update:
https://www.bagoum.com/deckbuilder#MTozNTUsMzoxOTA1MiwzOjExMDE2LDM6MTA5OTMsMzoxMTA4NCwzOjE5MDUwLDM6MTAwMjAsMzozNjMsMzoxMDk4MSwzOjExMTI2LDM6MTA5NTcsMzoxMTEzMiwzOjMyOSwzOjExMTM2
Summary
This deck packs a lot of healing and utility two drops, stuff maev likes to run anyways. But in this deck we go a little overboard and have almost nothing but two drops complete with cycle and extra replaces.
The deck has one major goal, and that is to play Q on six mana, stabilize on seven, and then string together back to back Arcane Devouerers into Reliquarian combos which assuming you were replacing correctly after Q should be 100% chance of drawing after Q deletes most of your deck for you. You tend to replace and dig for Q, and you usually toss away the other combo parts since Q makes them easy to draw, although if your around five mana plus you tend to hold onto them so as to make drawing them even more consistent after Q, or just incase you cant find a Q.
For those that don’t know how Reliquarians effect works, it sacrifices an abyssian faction unit to create an artifact with an attack bonus equal to the sacrificed units attack, and when you attack a minion with it you steal health equal to the attack bonus. So if you sacrifice an arcane devouerer you get a whopping eight bonus to attack so you can do ten damage face, or if you hit a minion you get a sixteen health swing. Due note that if you sacrifice a neutral minion you only get the attack buff and no lifesteal affect, and if you somehow have a different faction unit in your control it has a unique effect depending on the faction. But for the most part you really only want to be sacrificing arcane devouerer.
3 Likes
That I cannot disagree with. It seems it’s a valid build but has no point besides being different by taking a wild turn into Tempo/Combo playstyle at 6+ mana. Could be useful some day to counter a specific metagame? IDK.
@miguelosz I think Aethermasters are really needed as we are doubling down on the risk of slumping performance when no ramp is to be found.
3 Likes
I disagree with this. Maehv’s face is already the primary target, but this time you have an ability and incentive to punch them back. BBS doesn’t matter - you can delay it by 1 turn or you can sacrifice a charge for additional damage. And punching them once is usually enough.
1 Like
I think there are certainly good arguments for both. As a general rule I find Grimwar to be the better card if you must choose between them due to always having an active unit, helping you avoid AOE, and letting you be either proactive or defensive. And in this case you have even fewer reliable targets for DFC.
But I also fully agree with all of unktrials1s points.
That being said I think you are missing a glorious opportunity to run Blood Echos. If you want to go the grimwar route I think you gotta try it out, its even Xor Friendly!
Here is an Echos Variant I threw together:
https://www.bagoum.com/deckbuilder#MTozNTUsMzoyMDA1OSwzOjIwMjI2LDM6MTkwNTAsMzoxMTA4OCwzOjIwMDQ5LDM6MzI2LDM6MTAzMDQsMzoyMDI1NywzOjIwMDU3LDM6MTkwNDUsMzozMDAwMiwyOjEwOTYxLDM6MzE4LDE6MzU3
4 Likes
I considered it and put Abhorrent Unbirth instead. In this case their effect is almost identical IMO.
3 Likes
You have a good point, it is almost strictly better. Be nice to fit both though. I was initially skeptical of Letigress over just Tiger but you may have another good point there to. This is a really cool idea, I am definitely going to try and test and refine it. Thanks for the inspiration.
Revised idea:
4 Likes
Well I only had some marginal success with it. To frequently I ran into the issue of just not having the field to make grimwar worthwhile, or alternatively using grimwar defensively but never being able to get in punch range. I can not think of any more optimization for it though. Its pretty decent, I added the final Draft to my thread and gave you credit for the inspiration.
But it did also inspire me to make two different lists borrowing from its principals:
The first going for Letigress and the more go to Xor package instead of the Mech/Tooth route I had previously tried for unbirth Xor. This seems to be the most successful of the batch:
https://www.bagoum.com/deckbuilder#MTozNTUsMzoyMDA1OSwzOjIwMjI2LDM6MTkwNTAsMzoxMTA4OCwzOjIwMDQ5LDM6MzI2LDM6MjAzNDgsMzoxMDMwNCwzOjIwMDU3LDM6MTkwNDUsMzoxMDAxMiwyOjExMTQ0LDM6MTExMTIsMTozNTc=
And then an update to an old favorite of mine Eternal Army Lillith:
5 Likes
Unleash the Evil should cost 7.
3 Likes
There is much that should be different
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This is the budget Cass I’m using on the lower ladder during this early season, to try avoid hitting newbies too much with my other abominable wallet builds. 
4 Likes
Looks solid! If I ever get back to Doolin’, I’m gonna hit Bronze with some pretty horrible memes 
4 Likes
Someone should keep this thread alive, heh?
I have some new/old brew here. Infinite Sarlacs, do you remember the archetype, guys?
[eternal swarm DW]MTozMDEsMzozMTQsMzozMTgsMzozNDAsMzozNTksMzoxMTAyMiwzOjExMDk1LDM6MTkwNDUsMzoyMDA0OSwzOjIwMTY2LDM6MjAxOTksMzoyMDI1NywzOjMwMDAyLDM6MzAwMzk=
Gameplay:
Start) Priority is to get DW cost reduction early. As early as possible and as much as possible. Resummon Carrion Collectors if you can. Don’t go aggro, back off.
Plan A) Summon Cheap Sarlacs and resummon them via echoes and consuming. Multiply the number of sarlacs. Play something that cashes swarm. Profit.
Plan B) Summon cheap Vorpals and Grimes. Attack with them then resummon via echoes or consuming. Due to the Dying Wish effect you actually produce swarm this way. Play something that cashes swarm. Profit.
The deck borrows the idea of playing Grimwar with Blood Echoes from @deathsadvocate’s eternal army deck, but goes in the different direction for swarm - DW direction.
Actually, wr is a bit higher than 50% in low diamond. Highrolls are disgusting. I love it.
The main problems are no hard removal and lack of draw power. I don’t like Desolator here since you can’t spam him with Lilithe, so Neko is my only choice. Anyway, if the opponent lacks dispel options, you would gain so much undying board by 5-6 mana turn that you’re not actually required to summon anything 
Gazer is for deck thinning.
GLHF.
I’ve already summoned gates 3 times with grimes resummoning 
7 Likes
Looks fun! I think you’d benefit from adding Ritual Banishing instead of Gazers, especially since you run Sarlac. Gazers’ face damage is bad for the artifacts and vs. hyper aggro decks. If you really need the draw, good ol’ Void Hunter might do the trick
4 Likes
Well, Gazers are a compromise between deck thinning and turn 1 play. I could also use inkling surge, but it costs 1 mana - too much I don’t always have enough mana to play BBS, inkling may make it even harder.
That said, maybe Void Hunter is a bro. Aggressively statted body which is going to cost 0 more often than not. I should try it.
5 Likes