Duelyst Forums

Lyonar Heal Deck too weak (Proposed Changes)

#1

I have played about 80 or so games with a Lyonar healing deck that I first saw played by Brian Kibler. After making numerous adjustments, I have come to the conclusion that the playstyle is slightly gimped due to restrictions on healing.

With Sunriser and Sunforge Lancer, the effects don’t work unless something is actually healed, as in the card has taken damage, and that damage is restored. So most of the time I feel like I’m focusing more on micromanaging my minion damage just so I can get the effects to go through. When I have 5 mana and no minions, I would like to summon a Sunriser and use my last mana on my bloodborn ability to activate Sunriser’s effect, but I can’t do that. Not unless she has taken damage. It feels like an unfair limitation when I see what all these other factions can do.

Another issue I have is actually getting a Sunriser or Sunforge Lancer in my hand. With 3 of both of those cards, I have a 6/40 chance of getting one in my hand with no means of searching them out. These cards are crucial to a healing deck and there have been games where I haven’t drawn any of them. If Lyonar had a card like “Restore 3 health to a minion or general. Add a random minion with ‘Sun’ in the name to your hand.” This would give you access to at least 5 different minions and would be a valuable addition to a healing deck!!!

I also propose a change to the limitation on effects that require healing to activate. Instead of all of the effects activating whenever “ANYTHING” is healed, perhaps change them to “Whenever a healing effect is activated on your turn…” This is a trade off in that your enemy no longer has to worry about his/her own healing effects procing yours, and in turn gives you easier access to your effects without having to worry about damage being dealt first. Maybe then I could take Blistering Scorn out of my deck.

Anyway, I hope these changes are taken into consideration. I’m very interested to know if other players find the Lyonar healing options underwhelming as well.

#2

Hey there fellow Healyonar player!

Could you post your deck list please? I haven’t been having these problems, so it’d help to give me an impression of your situation.

On the math: assuming you have neither Sunforge Lancer nor Sunriser in hand on turn 1 your likeliness of replacing into one would be 40 - 1 (General) - 5 (Hand) = 34. You can’t replace into the card you’re replacing so if you have three copies of that card in your deck we get 34 - 3 (the replaced card) = 31. 6 (copies of your desired cards) / 31 = 19.35% for your first replace, not counting the draw at the end of your first turn and not drawing your mulligan odds either. It’s by no means a guarantee, but it’s (counting those other factors) over 5% more likely than your projection suggests. And you get three tries to draw into one before the end of turn 2. Hope I calc’d that right.

This might be relevant to your interests.

#3

Actually, I think the “replace does not give the same card” only works when you replace in game, not when you mulligan before game.

#4

I purposely left that issue vague because I’m not sure how it works; I suspect that you’re correct, but all I wanted to show is that mulligans give you two extra shots at drawing your desired cards.

#5

Is there a built in forum feature to post my deck or do I just have to take a screenshot in game and post that?

#6

Easiest way to go (imo) is to use the Manaspring Deckbuilder. You can share your deck in a bunch of ways, if you prefer a screenshot that’s fine too.

#7

Here’s what I’ve got going on. I would like to mention that I did make it to gold last season with this deck, but I hit a brick wall when I tried to progress further.

2lclow8.jpg340×1171 136 KB

#8

Well the list looks fine to me (I’d cut the one-ofs and reduce the 2-ofs) although I think Solarius’ draw effect comes into play a turn or two too late, but I’ll get a bit more into the substance of your argument.

I agree Healyonar isn’t quite there yet, Day Watcher is promising but I suspect the archetype won’t be a real threat until we get a 5- or 6-mana big threat specific to Healyonar. How are you playing Zir’An herself; is she in the thick of thing or are you keeping her back? Ideally she’s always body blocking and taking damage so you can heal your with your Elixirs and Mystics so you don’t run into the frustrating 5-mana Sunriser + nothing turns. Have you tried Day Watcher? I don’t agree on your idea for changing the Purity effects; having to damage your own stuff is a huge part of what makes this archetype so challenging and fun to play!

#9

Generally I do get my Zir’An straight into the fight and keep her there. If I get fortunate with a Sunforge Lancer or two, she ends up doing the majority of my damage.

I did try Day Watcher briefly, but not enough to see his potential in the deck.

As for my proposal on changing the fundamentals of healing effects to activate card effects, I still believe it is a needed change to bring Healyonar to a level that is actually a threat. Once again I’d like to stress, it feels like a huge limitation when compared to the crazy things that other factions can do.

But hey, here’s an idea. Give Lyonar a cheap rush minion with about 4 health and 1 attack. That would go a long way towards enabling healing effects with the current format. Hell, make it cost 1 or 2 extra mana and give it a healing effect when it attacks. Something like this would be extremely valuable. A must have in a heal deck.

#10

Yeah, I just decided screw it and made a much simpler deck with Argeon. I felt much stronger and had a much easier time of winning.

Sorry, but I am 100% convinced now that Healyonar needs work. Not having to worry about healing to get my effects was like taking off training weights. So liberating.

#11